Transcript+
It all comes down to computers communicating. The information superhighway can be a confusing mix of on ramps and off ramps. Bitcoin is worthless artificial gold. Is it still rat poison? Probably rat poison squared. We need to get into the world of OK, this is actually foundational technology. What the Internet of money? Does is it creates a single network which can do a microtransaction to a giga transaction. The Internet is going to be one of the major forces for reducing the role of gun. The one thing that's missing that that will soon be developed is a reliable E cash. Welcome back to Final Settlement. It's been a little while since Michael and I have have graced the airwaves here, but we're back in the saddle for for 2025 and very excited for today's episode a little, you know, housekeeping before we jump into things. If you're familiar with the show final settlement and where it sort of lies in the on ramp media umbrella, It's very it's been very much focused on sort of going beyond the digital gold thesis, if you will, and looking at Bitcoin as a piece of technology, a protocol and really speaking with builders and entrepreneurs and venture capitalists who are investing in focus on the space. And so that's been, you know, primarily where our guests have come from and they'll continue to be the case. But what we're what we're thinking about doing into the new year is really more tightly integrating what we're doing with final settlement with what Michael and I are working on at early riders are Bitcoin denominated investment firm. So, you know, something that we've seen on the on ramp side is that a lot of private clients come in and you know, they have their Bitcoin exposure, but they ultimately want exposure to private investments in the Bitcoin space or the periphery of the Bitcoin space, which is predominantly what we're focused on at at early riders. And so this pod going forward will be sort of a, a cross collaboration between on ramp and early riders. And we'll dig a little bit more deeper into sort of the investment theses that we we hold at early riders, also some portfolio companies and just really use it as a, a form of due diligence. If we're talking to builders in the space or entrepreneurs that are launching different businesses, that'll be sort of the the renewed format going forward. So Michael, did I do a good job of of covering the new format or anything to add there? Yeah, I'm super excited. We have a lot of updates in 2025. Obviously a lot of energy coming in the space with the new administration, a lot of bullish structural things happening in Bitcoin. And what we've seen at On Ramp is a lot of private clients and individuals coming in and looking to either build around multi institution custody or want to get exposure to the things that we're seeing. After they go down the rabbit hole, it's like what's the next step because they ultimately want to either integrate their business or themselves. And then on the other side, early riders has been putting out really amazing research talking about not only the thesis, but thinking in a world where Bitcoin is the denomination around investments. And also how do you just think about a future world like mortgage structure? A lot of the folks that come and allocate on the early rider side or look at on ramp understand multi institution custody and understand how that is going to be fundamental to the growth of the asset class because of the properties it has versus centralized custody and also, you know, single points of failure that ultimately exists with individuals. And so now it's about tightly integrating that and looking at opportunities in the market. There's a lot of interesting things that we've been seeing to Brian's point, having the first doing two a month to start, first one going down, it's just being more structured with the segments and what's happening in the business space. The second one, bringing on a builder and look through their sector, what's happening, what are the gaps, because there's ultimately a lot of gaps as SAB and things we'll talk about today get repealed, the banks are going to step in. But the reality is the banks don't really know much about Bitcoin. And so the idea is to bring signal between the Bitcoin and Tri space here. And then the last part is we have an exciting partner joining the firm. And so he'll be joining with us on the next episode. We'll be introducing him, but for today, excited to have Glenn, who is an advisor to early writers. And then this isn't public yet, but it'll be public by the time this episode launches, is joining On Ramp Institutional to lead our global efforts? And it won't steal his Thunder. So I'll let him share what he's going to be working on with On Ramp. Yeah. Thanks a lot, guys. Yeah, so I'm super excited. I'm making the leap from Triadfi into Bitcoin full time. You know, in my last role, I was working it as a institutional investment consultant, was involved in the first British pension scheme to make an allocation to Bitcoin and, you know, did a global search for the right vehicle to get that exposure through. And I was looking, you know, in my personal capacity, I hold my Bitcoin in a multi cig of course. And what at that time I did and was looking for a multi cig solution for institutional invasives to the global search over 70 funds we looked at and found on ramp and worked very closely with them for more than a year to get everything, all the due diligence done and whatever. So became very familiar with the on ramp multi institutional custody and the on ramp Bitcoin trust. And then Michael and I had a chat and decided to make the leap full time. And really my role in the firm's going to be bridging that gap between the traditional finance base looking to integrate Bitcoin into portfolios and looking for how to do that in the best and most secure way possible. So yeah, very excited. Yeah, England, you're, you're very unique because for a number of reasons, but one in particular for this first episode is because you have a background in the traditional finance space, investment management and you put together amazing reports and diligence and models. But then you also are just genuinely excited and passionate about the space in general. So you've gone down the rabbit hole when it comes to cross-border payments, insurance, credit facilities. And that's kind of the idea almost in its essence of this show as to let's talk about the existing market. And then how does Bitcoin effectively repurpose the will not recreates it? Because I think that's a been a fundamental like misnomer the past 15 years in this space is we're just going to recreate and blow up everything. And the reality is maybe there's a few things on the margins that completely change, but most things exist for a reason and that they just got lost around the system and the trust that was built. And so it'll be fun to talk through this. And then just future reports and collaborations on your knowledge of just the technicals along with kind of the the trad Phi like legal regulatory bureaucracy that always comes along with it. Yeah, I'm, I'm super passionate about Bitcoin. I mean, I literally wake up in the morning for Bitcoin. And so, you know, and I, I think you're exactly right. I think we're kind of at the phase in Bitcoin technology development just before the 1st iPhone was released, right? And early riders is looking for the right investments to make in that environment. Because like you say, it's going to be integrated into, you know, every single financial services sector, you know, cross-border payments, insurance, you name it. But then even, you know, local payments, it's going to take time, but we're sealing, you know, the first glimpses of that kind of stuff. So it's super exciting time, especially with the new administration coming in in a favorable, you know, regulatory environment on the horizon. At Onramp, we believe that Bitcoin is the most important asset of the 21st century. The hard part is securing it right There are shortcomings with keeping your coins on an exchange, but also with setting up your own self custody arrangement. Onramp solves for these concerns. Our multi institution custody solution maximizes security and minimizes counterparty risk, ensuring that your Bitcoin remains securely in your possession and provides built in inheritance planning to ensure your family is protected as well. Onramp provides Peace of Mind for your Bitcoin journey, whether for your whole stack or for part of it as a compliment to your existing self custody setup. For more information, check us out at onrampbitcoin.com. Yeah, it's a, it's a very salient point, Glenn, in that, you know, I, I've said this in the past and I'll, I'll continue to say it, but like on a long enough time scale, every company is a Bitcoin company, quote UN quote, right? It's very similar to how there were Internet companies in the mid to late 90s. Those are just companies now, right? Like obviously you're leveraging the Internet, Obviously you're leveraging these new forms of technology. Bitcoin is just monetary technology and it's to your point, it's going to take a while for people to get up to speed on what this thing even is. How to integrate it. Sort of the the lowest hanging fruit is just integrate it as a, as a reserve asset, treasury reserve asset. That that's the simplest way to get involved and at least shore up your sort of economic foundation of your business or whatever you're doing is by integrating a better form of money. And then beyond that, it's the tech stack and, and all the things you sort of reference there, whether it be payments or just receiving, you know, taking Bitcoin as payment doing, doing various different things with the tech stack itself in addition to just using it as a treasury asset. And so that's I think a longer burn, But I think initially and we've already seen this, right? Like if you just look at 2024, sort of a banner year for corporate treasury adoption, I think I haven't tallied up all of the companies, but large and small, public and private, across the board. There are, you know, every day it seems like, or at least every other day, it feels like a new company is announcing a Bitcoin treasury strategy. And you said one thing in there, Glenn, that I, I wanted to just pull on for a second. And you know, the, the on ramp Bitcoin Trust, which, you know, we may or may have discussed on this show before, but it was actually the first product that that on ramp launched, which I don't know if many people know, but you know, we're obviously doing more than just the trust at this point. But it was the first product because that was the main gap that we saw at the time. This was pre ETF and it was effectively, you know, let's just create a better version of the Grayscale trust, which had a number of issues that people are familiar with. But Glenn, I was, I was going to ask, can you give a little bit more color on how, how that diligence process played out in terms of, you know, why the on ramp Bitcoin trust made sense relative to the ETFs? Because at the time you were doing the diligence, the ETFs did exist. And so you know, what were the main considerations in your mind at that point? Yeah. So first thing that I mentioned is Bitcoin is a unique asset in the sense that you can have one more than one custodian at a time, right? You can't custody any other type of asset like that, right? So that was on the table. I also wanted to work with Bitcoin experts. I, I didn't want to work with a generalist, you know, he's dealing in equity or bonds. I didn't want to deal with somebody who doesn't understand the difference between Bitcoin and cryptocurrency because that tells me they don't really know what they're doing right off the bat. And then we were looking for a securitized vehicle because we wanted to put it on an institutional platform with along with the other assets to make it easy to monitor the exposure in the portfolio, potentially rebalance through that mechanism. We also didn't want any gating provisions, any lock up periods. We're also concerned about because for example, in the ETFs, if you go and read the the terms and conditions, they can gate the funds at any time. And so you can imagine in the case of a hard fork, all of a sudden they gate the fund and you know, you can't decide which fork you want to follow. We also wanted our own address for the pension scheme, so our own Bitcoin address, so we could actually see the Bitcoin on with with a blockchain explorer. And then also we wondered in kind subscriptions and redemptions like so thinking to the future, right, you know, what we've just been talking about is bitcoins going to be more than just an asset sitting in custody at some point? And so we want to do, you know, prepare for that future. And the other big thing on my mind that I've mentioned a number of times and to various people and audiences before is that we didn't want to be in a situation where if a custodian went bankrupt, we were going to have an issue, right? As a investment consulting firm, you know, you know, we, we're already kind of pioneers. We were pioneers in getting a British pension scheme to make the allocation to Bitcoin. Couldn't afford to make a mistake, right? And I remember back when, you know, before FDX blew up, you know, everybody was like, oh, but it's FTX, you know, what's the problem? You know, and Sequoia. Sequoia did diligence right. It should should. Be yeah, and teachers pension fund in Canada and whatever we're all investing in FTX. And you know, and it's exactly the same today. Who are the custodians of these ETFs, right? And everybody's like, oh, but it's this, oh, but it's that it's no problem, right? And it's it's, it's not a problem until it is, right? And if you can take that risk out of the equation, well then, if you're doing your job properly, you should. Yeah, I think there's an interesting aspect of like where we sit on this intersection and what's happening now because like to be fair, this is going to sit there's this is going to sound like two different things, but they're both true. Is the honor Bitcoin trust is the most sophisticated private placement or or vehicle that exists on the planet earth from spot allocation from Bitcoin only to the way the units are handled to the delivery you can take delivery multi institutional custody. It's also the most unsophisticated Bitcoin product you could ever create. It's just that the traditional financial system, the world, the way that institutions understand the asset, they're mapping it to the existing models of everything they've held. And what Glenn said is a, it's an interesting point because I've always thought this of, you know, like in the early 90's, the Internet mapped to the standard of like what existed in the, the physical analog world. And they just like moved it over. So there was nothing dynamic or 3D about it. And it wasn't until around the iPhone that you essentially got GPS and you got this thing they can carry around in your pocket. And you had Airbnb and Ubers and all these disintermediations of like these physical things. And I think of like collaborative slash multi institution custody is the first time you're kind of seeing what custody will look like with a 3D asset because historically it's been treated as a 2D way, which is somebody holds it and you hope to God they give it back to you. And that hasn't proven correctly. And one of the key themes that I think is going to be fun. I haven't even shared too much with you. I've kind of hinted it. I want to pull up is so everybody knows that Bitcoin is emergent from the like Bitcoin's emergent from the individual level. Like we all know that consensus to one hardcore, you know, cypherpunks all the way down the past 15 years. Now we're getting institutions, but at the same time, those institutions are generally led by, as our friend Alex Leishman likes to say, I think a orange dictator. It's the sailors, it's the you know, Elon's whoever is OK and has majority share can go say, look, we're going to adopt this. But why I share that I think everyone's familiar with that is those individuals or who adopt or who will drive the market forward for all products and services. So even though everyone knows the black rocks, the being wise, these large names and thinks that they will actually drive, it'll actually be fundamentally the the other side simply because the majority of Bitcoin sits with individuals and they will be the first to be sophisticated, look for other products. And again, because they have consensus of one, they can ultimately pick the new standards. Because when we talk with institutions, we're talking with some of the largest firms in the world to participate, partner with our firm told keys, and they're always shocked when we show this exact thing. And I think this is something that nobody talks about is that 70 percent, 1.4 trillion out of the $2 trillion market cap in Bitcoin sits with individuals and nobody serves those individuals. The best that has been created is basically, uh, collaborative custody where spread your keys around, your seeds around wildfire comes, Hopefully you're not out of the game. Flood comes, you're not at the game, somebody robs you, you're not at the game. Like there's broken market structure that exists in the space. And that's not to count the carrot, which is financial services. You still want to treat this thing at money. And at best, if all the keys are hidden underneath your mattress in your second house, well, then how do you start to like do things with them without people following you? It's just something that hasn't been fully thought out. Nobody talks about. And so I think when we think about building products at on Ramp, but then also at early writers, when we're looking at opportunities, there's an asymmetric information, as long as this thesis is right, where you can start to build sound fundamental, resilient things that will like be generational businesses because historically the businesses that have been created are 2D businesses with I give you the gold, you give me the horse, I give you the dollars, you give me the Bitcoin. That's the best we've come up with. And we think that's going to be generational and it's just not yet there. And we're so like early that it's hard to miss, kind of like the forests of the trees. Yeah. The other, the other element of this is it just logically makes sense if once you once you are sophisticated enough and you know far enough down the rabbit hole, it's pretty logical that you would want the custody of a super decentralized asset to also be decentralized or or at least distributed in some way, right. And so that's, that's really the crux of everything that we're doing at on ramp with our approach to custody is just there, there should be a, a way to introduce fault tolerance and redundancy to your setup. Historically, that's, that has not been the case for the 1st 16 years of bitcoins history. Whether you're doing self custody or a third party custody, there's some single point of failure, whether that's yourself or an entity. And even if you're doing your own complex multi sig, if you are, you're still the single point of failure because you know where those keys are, you know, hopefully you have them geographically dispersed, but the reality is, you know, not everyone has two homes. So it's not actually that realistic for everyone to have a, a geographically dispersed multi sig set up for themselves. So what ends up happening is, you know, you, you are technically using multi sig, but both of those keys that you control or all three of them are in the same place, which which sort of defeats the purpose. And so really everything we're doing from a custody perspective is saying. Well, hold on, there should be a way to introduce fault tolerance here because how else are you going to get people to allocate meaningful amounts? And I think that's genuinely the reason. You know, we've sort of been, I think the institutions are here now, but for probably the past five to seven years, we said the institutions are coming. And I think a lot of the reason that they hadn't come is because there's there's no way for them to get confidence around the custody. Are you? You're either trusting a single entity or you figure out key management yourself. And that just hasn't been realistic or palatable for, for these types of folks and also for individuals. To Michael's point, once you're storing 90 plus percent of your net worth in this asset and a 10X is a couple times, it becomes very real and, and, and you don't necessarily want the keys in your house. And so that's that's the other elements of this where it's like we need to improve the market structure, we need to improve the products and services that are available and do it in a way that people can have more confidence to store more of their net worth in this asset. That's why you see sort of individuals at the margin who say, you know, maybe I'll shave off some Bitcoin here, but just really because they want to put it in another asset that they know they won't get attacked for or they'll lose. You know, the house is the house. It's going to be there. Well, unless it burns down, I suppose. But yeah, that that's, those are just some some reoccurring themes that we've seen and and influences everything we're doing. Yeah. And I think the transition because they don't want to make this fully about you know on ramp or multi decision question. That's an aspect of this to Brian, not maybe to be fair, the banks have accepted not because of fully custody. It's because there's been this pull up on this screen, this notion of SAT 121 and the accounting requirements from a ratio perspective that is basically hindered banks from being able to custody the asset. To Brian's point, what's super exciting and everything we've kind of, you know, everybody paying attention to space has seen from since the inaugurate or the election is the favorable administration. The folks getting in place that I know Glenn wants to to chat about. But I think pulling this up is relevant because just this week this came out rumors that on executive order first day Trump will repeal that, which a lot of folks have been waiting for. So it allows other banks to step in point in all that, though, is that they'll still do centralized custody and that's going to be the opportunity for different differentiation, which is very exciting. But then we've seen to just this week was the first, the largest bank in Italy did their first quote UN quote test. It was like kind of a test to put it on their balance sheet. But they also traded using their their propriety like their their trading engine that's been in like research and development. And then what was the O Signum, a native digital asset bank just reached Unicorn status. So you kind of seen and we've seen anybody close to the space for the past year seen the like rumbling that banks are starting to place their kind of chips on the table and where they're going to place their bet on the type of infrastructure partners because they really they don't have the best lens on this space. And so again, going back to the theme of just like information research, take this for what it is and look at the market is that there's a wide gap in opportunity because more than likely all the banking infrastructure is more than likely going to look exactly the same as everyone else. And that's perfectly fine until something like 2022 happens and then everybody runs. That's when all this stuff on the margins, like you can win a few clients, but it's always when the counterparty risk goes bid. Then people wake up and like, oh shit, maybe there was a better way to do all this. Exactly. I mean, I was working during 2008 and believe me, nobody thought Lehman's could ever go bankrupt, right? So you know, there's nobody who can't go bankrupt, right? If, if, if Dave, and right now we, I did some research, right? If you add the unfunded liabilities of the United States or Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security, the defined benefit pension schemes that the government's unhooked for, to the national debt, the debt to GDP ratio in the US is 950%, right? And people always talk about Japan, right? Including all of those underfunded liabilities and everything, Japan's debt to GDP ratio is about 300, right? So that puts things in perspective. And you know, the subprime mortgage crisis and all of that kind of stuff. I mean, that looks like, you know, if this sort of date Ponzi scheme runs into trouble, I mean, it's going to that's going to look like a Sunday picnic compared to what's going to go on here. So you know, you and you've got a bare assets because a lot of what we were talking about earlier with Cassidy, like those people whose houses, you know, tragically burned down in the Palisades in LA, they're not worried about the equities or their bonds and stuff like that because that's all held on a central registry at, you know, like a tribe fried custodian, right. But Bitcoin, it's a digital asset, right? And so if the custodian goes bankrupt, they're not just holding a entry in a Ledger, they're holding the actual underlying asset, right? And that's why you can't rely because what the ETFs rely on is a thing called Article 8, right, which is meant to give them banks the the grants of trust, bankruptcy remoteness, but it's totally untested in court. So in the risk disclosures in the S1 filings for the S with the ACC that have to spell out their lawyers say to them, you have to say we don't know what will happen if the custodian goes bankrupt. It will be decided by a court. And if a court decides the wrong way for you, you lose all your Bitcoin, right? So. Yeah. Can you, can you describe any part of this? Glenn is in the work you'll be doing is on the the financial advisors side and also like some of the corporate treasury stuff. But I think that there's an interesting dynamic with the financial advisors doing dil due diligence Raas you reference. I think you have like more hope for Raas in the short order than other firms, given that they run businesses and they can feel and they have to look their client in the eye if they put them in a bad position. If you can talk through that because I think that's where there's just, there's a big gap in that area of the market just for, for products that map to what their clients need. There's really nothing other than sending them some somewhere to go manage the devices and hope that they don't lose them. And then they call them all the time saying there's phishing attacks and all these problems or they have to put them in I bit and they know it's not a good product. So just anything you can share on that? Yeah, so, So in the US, they're called TAMPS. In other parts of the world, they're called DFMS, discretionary fund managers and I actually set up a DFM in an asset manager, right, so a temp, but in another part of the world and So what I know about DFMS is they build portfolios for RAA firm. So if you go to an RAA firm, most of the time they're not actually building your portfolio for you. A specialist portfolio management companies, building the portfolios for the RAA firm. And then the RAA firm is doing financial planning for the individual clients and then selecting from a range of funds that is suitable for that client, right? Age, investment horizon, risk tolerance, all that kind of thing. Now the RAA firm, so the RAA advisor is charging usually a basis points fee, like half a percent or 50 basis points on assets under management per client, right? And we read a survey of 400 U.S. financial advisors a couple of days ago where they where they asked financial advisors how many of your clients are asking you about Bitcoin. And this survey said 70 percent, 70% of their clients asking them about Bitcoin, right? And then the same server, they got a question saying only 20% of them can actually give their clients exposure, right? So their clients are going off and buying the Bitcoin, right? And then holding it in a plastic device at home, you know, or going to a collaborative custody solution or whatever, right. But it's not being taken into account as part of their whole portfolio, right? So it's kind of something that and there's no, you know, there's a lot of behavioral invasive behavior kind of stuff when it comes to a volatile asset like Bitcoin. That's where you, it's a good idea to have an advisor who know, who's understands Bitcoin to say to you, this is the right allocation for your portfolio. And when you know, we go through a bear market, don't worry about it, this is normal, etcetera. But also advisors want to be able to incorporate it in a portfolio setting rather than just be something that their clients are doing on the side. Also means the advisors got more assets under management. And a lot of now because of the situation, a lot of clients are sitting with the Bitcoin on a trace or a cold card or something like that. And for them now to give it over to their financial advisor, they'd have to sell that Bitcoin and then buy into an ETF, right? Which for the reasons we've already discussed is probably not the best idea. Instead, what you can do with something like the on ramp Bitcoin trust is you can make an in kind subscription, right? So you can just transfer the actual Bitcoin into the trust, right? And then the advisor can incorporate it into your portfolio. It's a great. Point we, we, we talk about the In Kind redemptions a lot, but that that example highlights why the In Kind subscription, you know, going both ways is actually very critical. Michael, were you going to say something to cut you off? Yeah. I was just going to say, I think, Brian, like a year ago, we talked with Chris Kuiper and some other individuals in the asset management space. And there was a lot of the discussion of like when do RAA start to adopt this? And it's like whether it's the price benchmarking indexes, like all these different things. And what's been really interesting the past, call it four weeks, I think post again election, the sentiment has changed. And maybe this was already in flight. It would have had to have been because if they shared this, But I think more people are emboldened. Like there's different like lines of demarcation where people get emboldened. For me personally was like 2020 when we knew that they were going to print the trillions. It's like, well, there's only one like valve to support. So why hedge anymore? Like, let's just go for it. And I think a lot of people was the truckers in Canada, Russian sanctions, everyone has their their point where they're like, screw it, like why am I going to hedge anymore? And we're starting to see Raas do this because CFP boards and also the SEC has have made it incredibly hard for Ras that have even wanted to allocate to IBIT. That's why a lot of these flows haven't even opened up. But anecdotally, talking with a few Ras and again, just trying to like think through how we, we message this podcast, it's like we're going to share, but then also share like opportunity sets. If you're a registered investment advisor thinking about getting into it, have a background investment management, there is an insane opportunity right now to have acumen in the traditional finance space, but have a favorable hint tint to Bitcoin because these RA's have are saying anecdotally that they've increased one said in in one year, they increased 5X their AUM by for the past four years from or brought in more UM, in this year than four years by they set up ADBA that was Bitcoin friendly. They started, I think had some different kinds of research partnerships. Another one reference, they want $200 million plus clients that only held like $1,000,000 in BTC. But people are starting to get fed up with the people that manage their money telling them that they're crazy or that they don't want to deal with the asset. And it's just a very big opportunity. And then as we talk about native products and services, that's a large gap. I don't have the numbers, but I know it's in, it's deep in the trillions that Ras manage of capital. And so that's another just big segment that has really been under underserved. And the reality is, like the ETF, people will wake up eventually, and then they're going to just leave people hungry for products and services. Yeah. And, and what you and Glenn just described, it's also it's, it's basically a double whammy because you, you have clients potentially leaving your platform, taking off assets off the platform to go invest in Bitcoin because you don't offer something. And then that segment of that person's wealth actually is like the growth engine engine for their future. So like that's, that's the piece that's actually going to appreciate much faster than everything that's actually under your purview. So you're getting hit sort of twice and maybe even three times if like they have kids and you know, their kids are not even ever going to give you their money because you don't offer something. They collated. Let's go four times if we're just going to do it because let's this reminds me of your shareholder letter that came out on ramp. Brian writes an annual shareholder letter, you know, to shareholders of the owner of Bitcoin Trust. And what we pulled up here is the return profile. I'll let maybe Brian go through it. But the point I was saying on the 4th whammy is their whole game is AUM accumulation and you know, denominated in dollars and what better asset to accumulate. You know, you can have 2% that looks like ends up being 10% of your total AUM in USD and they've just completely missed it. And we've always known this. And I think that's going to start to shift as this like asset grows. People like, wait, why are we like stigmatizing it versus like embracing it? But then at the end of the day, like there's only so many people that can embrace it versus to differentiate. And then it kind of just becomes norm, which is also bullish for the long term asset. Yeah. So there's a few things going on here that I talk about in, in this year's letter and it, and it relates to everything you just said. But it's, it's really it, it sort of calls into question, you know, why would you be paying a financial advisor in the 1st place? If if everything that they're going to put you into, whether those be active strategies across different asset classes, if they're not going to be able to outperform just the benchmark indices, which for the past 20 years, it's basically become harder and harder for active managers to outperform, then what are you paying them for? And so the even even beyond that, you know, if you were to just with this chart here at the bottom shows is, you know, effectively the S&P 500 is it is gotten more and more concentrated over time at the top. So those top 7 or so magnificent 7 companies comprise 1/3 of the index today and drive the vast majority of the returns for the index. So while, you know, passive index investing was really initially meant to be this sort of risk mitigated diversified approach, you're, you know, you're owning a piece of, of a given market. It's really just become, you know, you're, you own these seven companies effectively. And so if that is the case, and it's also becoming harder and harder for someone doing active strategies to actually outperform these indices, then again, what are you paying a financial advisor for, particularly if they're resistant to the one asset that might actually let you outperform? So it's, it's this strange paradox that I think we're, we're, we're still in the early stages of people grappling with these realities of sort of this active passive debate. And, you know, that's, that's been the trend, right? The trend of capital flows for the past 20 years has been towards these passive index strategies and that's what's actually led to that concentration over time in these top seven names. And so financial advisors are just in a precarious place at this point because they're struggling to outperform these benchmark indices, which are much lower cost alternative to someone paying them advisory or management fees to invest their portfolio. So they, they've been up against that for 20 years and now they're also up against this thing called Bitcoin, which is actually even at a very modest allocation, able to get someone's portfolio to outperform those benchmarks effectively with actually less volatility, which is the crazy part. And we have a report on this, which I'll put in the show notes. But effectively, a small allocation to Bitcoin can increase your returns of a of a aggregate 6040 portfolio while actually dampening the volatility, which is like completely absurd and like the Holy Grail of investing. You want to boost returns and and, you know, limit the volatility. And so that is not very well understood just yet, but it's beginning to permeate. And I think. Yeah, that letter was really just, you know, an effort to point out those realities in the traditional finance world, the advisor world, and compare it and contrast it with, well, what is Bitcoin in that active passive debate? And I sort of described it as an actively passive allocation in that it is passive in the sense that like you're just buying and holding it. We're not, you know, we don't suggest any sort of active trading strategies around Bitcoin. The asset. It's, it's very much just accumulate and hold. So in that sense, it feels passive. But on the other hand, it's arguably like the most active macro bet that you can make in that it is this form of outside money, similar to gold, but digital that isn't connected or within the realm of Fiat denominated assets, which would be called, you know, inside money. And so that is a very active bet saying effectively, you know, going back to what Glenn, you were talking about, that's GDP unfunded liabilities. Like it's a bet against that. It's saying that's unsustainable. So I'm going to move my money to a form of money that can't be debased by that system. And so, yeah, it's this, it's this beautifully active passive bet in my mind that I think financial advisors are just scratching the surface of, of waking up to basically. Yeah, go ahead, I'll ask. You a question go. Ahead, I have a question for you because I think So what Brian just said, I think for some folks down the rabbit hole would would pick up. I think others that are starting to on a cursory level, probably like over their head, maybe a little bit DBD on who it is, but it reminds me of at the end of the day, like we focus so much on these podcasts. I think people will get a lot of their education from the podcast because not only I think there's some people that like to read or listen versus read, but I think that there's something I don't want to know if intimate's the right word, but interpersonal of like hearing thing, people you like, you can gener generally over course of a long enough number of hours pick up if they're genuine, if they have integrity, all these things. And this is how like Bitcoin's really scaled is like through this version of podcast. And it reminds me of like, there's just this big asymmetry on education on what Brian shared, because all the information's out there, but for some reason it hasn't been put together and then aggregated and packaged up. Because on the other side of the RA space, what we're going to see if you're not educated is, well, there's always going to be every cycle we've seen this where there's new structured products or things that exist to take people's money, either their Bitcoin or their money that would have went into Bitcoin. And it always at the time looks good and then retrospect. You're like, man, I should have saw that and that was like the last anchor and all these like different yield generating things. And me, this is kind of going to be a little bit of a polarizing statement. But I think there's something with the securitization of corporates and treasuries and bonds and like all these things because I think there's some soundness to them. But then a lot are going to go do a playbook that are effectively between me and you. It's like we have a, you know, salary that pays $60,000 a year and we're taking out 100,000 and then 150 in credit card debt. Will that like goes out if like there's a little bit of mismanagement and volatility, which we all know is in Bitcoin. So point in saying all that is like, where have you ever seen this in an asset or anything that the asymmetry is literally just being educated because that's where all of this stuff stems from is like if somebody's educated, it becomes very easy to understand passive, hold the asset, just hold spot, don't do anything else, don't allocate. Like it's this is over a long time horizon's not going to outperform, but we're still have 10 years based on the conversations we have anecdotally of people recognizing all this, which is an opportunity, but it's also means that they're just going to be a lot of like pain and tears for a while. Yes, I'm going to come to your question, but I just wanted to add a little bit of color to what Brian was saying was. So how is it possible that you take this asset that on its own looks super volatile, right? It's got a high average annual return, right? And you put it in a portfolio and it increases the portfolio of your return, but your whole portfolio's volatility goes down. How is that possible? So for the sake of the audience, because, you know, like if you talk to me about, you know, astrophysics or something, I'm not going to understand what you're talking about. So, you know, not everybody understands how an investment portfolio is built, right? What you're looking for is you're looking for assets that are uncorrelated. In other words, when one's doing well, the other one's doing badly and vice versa. But overall, you're doing, you're kind of climbing the stairs and you kind of have a smooth return because something's making up for something else when something's doing badly, right? So it turns out that Bitcoins got a very low correlation with other assets. And I think for a lot of investment professionals who don't understand Bitcoin, they think that that's a like just an anomaly, right? So it's just like this. Weird. I also think it's not true. They also think it's not true because they they're thinking in shorter time frames of like the past week, OK, S&P sold off, Bitcoin sold off. It's like, no, you need to look at correlations over much longer time frames. And when you do that, that's that's what you say. Even over 30 days, the average correlations, because they're non stationary, right? It'll kind of look like it's correlated for a few days, then it'll go negative. But if you look at the average correlation over time, it's very close to 0, right? It's not negative. It's got no relationship with other assets. But why is that? What is the fundamental reason for that? It's because everything else is denominated in this in dollars or EUR or pounds or something like that. And the supply of those can be manipulated, right? So it makes sense that this asset that cannot be manipulated by monetary policy should have no relationship. That's that inside, outside, right? This asset exists outside of the financial system. There's only one real other one, which is gold, right? So there's that in terms of so people kind of to your point, Michael, people being able to see something early. I mean, that's definitely the case that's happened before, right? It happened with private equity. Nice. It's funny now like working in the institutional space, you look at private equity returns and you know, there's so much selection risk and stuff like that. Most of the time you don't outperform private equities or you very marginally do. And then after costs you don't, right. And it's because not every investor and his dog are invested in private equity, right? The alpha's over. It's, you know, like the illiquidity premium is being squeezed out of the market because, you know, they're just shoving assets in there. And it's not just about the private equity managers making fat fees, right, and earning the carry. So this is, you know, it happened with a junk bonds, right, high yield bonds, right, Early in the day, you could get huge credit spreads right now, credit speeds are all time record lows, right? So for the risk, the credit risk, you're saying you're getting the least amount in history of extra return for taking all that credit risk, right? And equities are way overvalued. If you look at a cyclically adjusted price to earnings ratio, which is most reliable valuation metric for equities, they've only been more expensive once in history, and that was at the peakofthe.com and bubble, right? And why is that? Because investors know, you know, proper investment professionals know what comes next when date levels are this high, right? There's only one way out, right? And that is to debase the currency. So every, nobody wants any cash. They don't want any short term bonds, they don't want any long term bonds. They don't want anything where it's directly tied to monetary policy. So they want assets, right? So everybody's shoving every last cent they can into assets. Everything's overvalued, right? And there's this one asset that's way undervalued, right? And this goes to the point you made in the newsletter, which was a brilliant 1, Brian, which is, yes, you could think of Bitcoin as a passive asset because you just buy it and you hold it, right? But the, the asset allocation decision to put Bitcoin in a portfolio is an active decision. And the, the decision you're making is you're saying there's all the stuff here, there's all this risk for all the reasons that I've mentioned. Everything's overvalued. There's so much data in the system, you know, even if you don't do it for the return potential, you should be hedging your risk with an outside money asset, right? Yeah, I think that's that's the more palatable argument probably today for most financial advisors is hey, just don't get screwed by not having any exposure here because the other side of it like being a little bit farther down the rabbit hole and and understanding what it could really do if you had a meaningful allocation to it. I think the issue there is, and I sort of alluded to this in the piece and, and some of my prior writings, but, and so is Jesse Myers in his yuppie elite piece, but it's, it's genuinely an ego thing and a hubris thing of, of saying this Bitcoin thing like, well, there's no, there's no edge there. Like it's just, it's again, a passive allocation. Like you just buy it and hold it. And so it becomes very hard for financial advisors or even at the more granular level, like a portfolio manager at a, at a investment fund to justify their existence effectively and say, oh, I'm, I'm charging 2 and 20 for this strategy that can't even outperform the S&P 500 and is getting absolutely crushed by Bitcoin. I can't just throw in the towel and buy Bitcoin and say like, oh, I, I'm my, my, you know, however many years of, of education, all my degrees, all my experience in on Wall Street actually isn't as relevant as I thought. Like, that is a hard pill for people to swallow. And so I think that that is a part of it too. And I think where I was going is like, so it's like a spectrum, right? Because there's the, what do you reference? Like somebody just saying, I want no exposure. And then reality is whether it's an individual or a company that is even getting closely involved in this space, it is, it's, it's almost, it is immaterial and it's definitely under allocated. And the way I was just thinking about this, it would almost be like, like in the early Internet days if you said, OK, this Internet thing's interesting, I'm going to use it to check the weather. And you didn't do anything else. Like you didn't use it for e-mail. Like, imagine if you did that versus if you fully embraced it, how much easier your life would have gotten, how much of A cheat code you have been playing. That's how I think about it. On the other side, it's still insane to me. And then 16 years in, individuals look at it as a risk asset. They diversify across different digital assets. They rebalance. This is all the common parlance in anybody that will put on a collared shirt and talk to you that you want to hear from because the other side of it is people screaming at you that like, you know, hold your plastic device and get your guns because it's all going to shit. And those that's just not commercial for people, they don't want to hear that. But there's sound fundamentals like that they're coming from, but it's just again, not packaged up in the right way. And so you have this other side of the spectrum that's doing that. And where this is like sparking in my head is on the banking side, right? Because like outside of like cash app, I'm probably missing one or two, but that has real commercial scale and like like brand cachet. There is not a Bitcoin only firm focus deeply. And what this sparked was because I was looking at the and this ties into the education on the sovereign stuff. I want to like roll to Glenn, but just to bring up this, so the signum bank, you know, Unicorn status, they've been lending Switzerland. You know, you get excited like, oh, this is a Bank of the future, a lot of things and then you roll into it and there's some cool stuff around Bitcoin. But then you kind of see like the focus around this 24/7 multi asset network. You know, I think there's multiple collateral for for like lending against. There's this tokenization, we're using chain link, there's an Ethereum ETF and you can't help as a business owner and builder look at that and be like, well, whatever percentage. And it's definitely a percentage that's not signal they're focusing on. And I mean, Glenn, you know, it's probably better than any, but it's probably even more than 50% because everyone there cannot understand what's happening. They're getting pulled in all these directions, which is again, that same analogy of like they're just picking up and checking the weather versus going deep into where the end state is. And so that it, that gap is such a wide opportunity just from education that nobody's really facilitated or done. And it's ultimately the difference between going starting here and then ending up at the end state where a lot of opportunity exists across the market. And it's not just financial services like Bitcoin's going to touch everything. Exactly. I mean, I think that like, you know, going back to Internet analogy, right, the early days of the Internet when it's just come out of DARPA was actually in the early 1980s, right? andthe.com bubble only happened in the 2000s. So that's a 20 year stretch, right? And there were individuals, a very, you know, small cohorts of people who could see what was coming with the Internet, right? And I think it's very similar in the world of Bitcoin right now. And, you know, once it sort of went mainstream, it also, youknowthe.com, bubblewaspets.com and this and that, and everybody was just checking money and anything and everything, just throwing darts at a dartboard. You know, we're not really thinking through things, understanding things. But there were some very smart individuals who knew what was happening, right? And they're still around today. People like Peter Thiel, you know, Mark Andreessen, those sorts of people. I mean, it's kind of surprising to me when Peter Thiel gets Bitcoin, Mark Andreessen doesn't, right? And I think that, you know, when you talk about the end state, right, that's where the alpha is, right? If you're going to take 5 or 10 or 20 or whatever percent of a portfolio and you're going to put it into digital assets, right? And then you spread it across a whole bunch of, you know, junk, right? Because you don't know what you're doing, right? That is crazy, right? So. I think you're right, but I think there's also. There's potentially an element of even if someone is super intelligent and able to grasp the end state, they might think they can make money in the interim with all the other bullshit. I think that. Is that is an element at play here with what Michael you described, it's like, you know, whether it's the the latest fad around tokenization or whatever it is, that goes back to what I was saying before. It's like that's how you justify charging fees to somebody's like, oh, like this is all so complex. Look at all these things. I need to help you, Mr. Client, figure out where to allocate your portfolio across digital assets. It's like, again, it comes back to like justifying their existence to some extent. And and yeah, like the the final point is just like it's possible that someone sees the end state of, of Bitcoin being the actual signal, but just thinks I can earn some fees in the interim until everybody else figures that out. Yeah, but I think. I think it's definitely the case. It doesn't make it true. It's definitely not right, but it also doesn't make it true because we saw with the hedge fund allocations, the top performer still underperform spot Bitcoin. So like they can think whatever they they, they do. And that's where like most people that trade around these publicly traded companies, they're in their mind is like they some again, there's different like levels of this, but I'm going to make more Bitcoin. It's like, yeah, good luck with that. Because that means you not only have to like pay attention to that versus what you were supposed to be paying attention to make you more Bitcoin, but then you have to exit the position. And then that takes mental burden and also tax obligations. And then you have to get in the other line, like how many people on the planet or there are people that can do that. They're called like Michael Jordan of trading. They're not like the guy that's like on Twitter that's listening to, you know, the pod, Glenn. So on this, this reminds me of kind of where I was bringing up the education was the sovereign game theory report, because I think this is a big component. Like you can get a lot more confidence in conviction around Bitcoin when you start to understand, you know, the petrodollar where things are going in this natural like need from a national defensive onshoring and manufacturing and what happens in that environment. Maybe do you want to we can be public now that you author that that report, I'll pull it up, but do you want to talk through maybe high level what went into it, just some of the themes and then I can pull up any of the particular kind of like parts in it? Yeah, sure. So, you know, it's super interesting. OK, so first we'll had Donald Trump at the Bitcoin 2024 conference kind of making pronouncements about Bitcoin and saying he's going to create a strategic Bitcoin reserve, right? Then he got elected, right? And then he starts making his announcements for who's going to point in various roles. Super interesting if you look at who he's appointing, right, Because you got Howard Lechnick, Secretary of Commerce, right? Who's the CEO account of Fitzgerald short while ago they announced that they're going to be doing Bitcoin collateralized loans. They've got a $2 billion facility there, OK. He's appointed David Sacks as the digital assets are to super pro Bitcoin and Fable points. And obviously also Howard Latnick because they custody all the Treasury assets for Tether, right? And then you've got Stephen Mirren as the chairman of the Council of Economic Advisors and Paul Atkins to lead the ACC, who are also both kind of super pro innovation Bitcoin digital assets. Paul Atkins couldn't have said more favorable things about Bitcoin, right? And So what are the chances that it's just coincidence that's, you know, the four people that are the most important in the world of, you know, the government world of finance, right, are all pro Bitcoin and sable coins. Chances are zero that you know, that's just luck, right? So what's going on? What is the agenda behind that? Right? And essentially what it boils down to is this. You look at Trump's worldview, right? He's saying, listen, our industrial base is getting hollowed out. You know, we're kind of losing our place in the world. The world's a dangerous place. You know, we need to kind of get back to, you know, America being the greatest country in the world. And The thing is that with the dollar as the reserve currency, and also with all the dates and everything like that, right, basically what happens is because there's so much global demand for dollars and Treasuries, it keeps the dollar stronger than it otherwise would be. And on a trade balance perspective, that means that for people to buy dollar, I mean, American goods is very expensive because the dollar's strong, right? And there's no way to weaken the dollar because it's the global reserve currency, right. Then at the same time, with the Russian freezing of the assets and kind of moving into the small sort of multi polar kind of world, the Russians and the Chinese and everything are saying, OK, we don't want to hold the dollar or dollar assets. I mean they have to, but you know to the extent and setting up central bank digital currencies and in bridge to do trade bilaterally between each other and buying lots of gold because they also know that the way out of this is probably debasement, right. And so you know, why do we want to hold something that's purchasing power is going to be debased. We want to hold hard assets. So gold, you know, central banks around the world, including this Bank of China and Russia, central banks buying record amounts of gold, more gold than they've bought in the last 50 years, over the last couple of years, right. And so Trump and his advisors are looking at this and saying, hang on, this doesn't make any sense. We're we're basically hollowing at our country. We're making ourselves militarily weak because you need a strong manufacturing base to have strong military, right? And you because of the situation, you, you don't have a strong industrial base, right? So what's the solution? Well, in the short term, we still need demand for treasuries, right? And our adversaries are kind of at the margin saying we're going to hold less and less of these and we're going to hold cold instead. And so how do we create a Petro dollar type system, right, for 2025, right? Well, what we do is we make dollar stable coins, the kind of global currency. If you go to Nigeria or you go to Argentina or you, you know all places in South America or Africa, anywhere in the merging world or whatever, people in the know are using dollar stable coins because their local currencies are terrible. And it's just way better to use a dollar stable coin. So if you kind of support that and you, you, you, you kind of promote it, right? Because dollar stable coins are backed by U.S. Treasuries. You create demand for treasuries in the same way that the Petro dollar system, through pricing oil in dollars, created demand for dollars and U.S. Treasuries, right? But then at the same time, you don't want too much money recycle back into U.S. Treasuries because the dollar then stays too strong and you can't solve this, these trade imbalances and whatever. And that's a lot to do with what the tariffs are about as well, OK? And so you need a neutral reserve asset, right? And what is the only neutral reserve assets? There's 2 gold and Bitcoin, right? But if you're smart, right, you realize that bitcoins the reserve asset of the future, gold's the reserve asset of the past. Bitcoin in every way, shape and form for global reserve asset is a better choice than Bitcoin. I mean, Bitcoin is better than gold. And So what you do is you create a place for where people can park their money rather than U.S. Treasuries, at least at the on the margins, right? In the beginning. At the same time, you in the short and medium term sustained demand for U.S. Treasuries because you need that to fund the government, right? But then if you create a strategic Bitcoin reserve and the game theory is such that because Bitcoin is a strictly scarce asset, right, first movers get the asset cheaper than later doctors, right? So you create a strategic Bitcoin reserve, you get in early, right? Or you know, early issue, you know, you may have some competition, but you're not going to have the whole world competing with you. And then, you know, as this becomes the norm and other as the other nations. I saw this morning the Malaysian president talking about this now, right? I saw the last week the Chile gap where somebody in the Chile gap were talking about it. It's it's, you know, it's spreading, right? And it's still kind of just lip service and talk. But at a certain point it's going to be real. And, you know, so you can start to pay off the national debt because now you've got this treasury reserve asset, right? So you can achieve a lot of aims here. I think it's a good recap. I think there's 2 core things to like that simplify a lot of what's in the paper would encourage her to read it. And then also Luke Roman has been really great the past I think few months and really come pulling this all together because there's a lot of like pieces and I think at the end of the day, what Glenn had references debasing the dollar. I think the the oversimplified version is debasing their exports because at the end of the day, every sovereign has what they export and import. And if they're effectively exporting goods and services that they need to import whatever they need to keep their citizens happy for not overthrowing, right? Again, just like oversimplifying, well, if they're sending out oil and they're getting dollars and those are being debased because they have to now go buy food, well, eventually you say like this doesn't make any sense for like the sovereignty. And in the way Groman explained it as post O 8, we didn't actually settle the debts and there we didn't reconcile what it should have been. And so that is since then has been the marginal buyer has decreased from treasuries into gold. And then the other thing that's super fascinating that was discussed was ultimately that at the end of the day, like the common thought in parlance from probably everyone is, well, this is all great for Bitcoin, but at the end of the day, it threatens the dollar. And that's never going to be like loud. And it's like that's true in some respect. But then there's another component of that, which is National Defense, national security. And that supersedes any dollar hegemony, simply because if you cannot protect your country, well, then what does the dollar matter? And we couldn't protect the Ukraine war, not being intimately familiar, but understanding that our manufacturer for whatever it is, can do like 130th to one 100th of what China can do in a week. And so everyone wakes up. It's like, look, it doesn't matter the dollar. We have to bring things back home. But when you bring things back home, you're naturally going to have inflation. And so you're going to have inflation and it's going to be drastic inflation. Well, then your citizens need an asset and assets to hold so they still have value to be able to spend on these goods. Because if you bring everything home and then everyone's poor and you're in a depression, well, what's what was the point? And so there's a lot of these dynamics. You start to squint and see how this all plays in. That doesn't really get talked about a lot. And where there's like 2 camps, I feel like in the barbell where it's like it's either going for sure going to happen or there's no way it's going to happen. And I think we all kind of tend to lean that like we don't know what it's going to be, but there's going to be some very drastic, like policy changes come inauguration. I think the other, the other element there just for the United States specifically in this game theory dynamics, it's like, well, there's a ton of people who already hold Bitcoin that live in the United States. So it, so it absolutely behooves us to basically revalue or or monetize Bitcoin at a faster rate because it helps our citizens. And, and the, the strategic reserve idea more than anything is like a signaling effort in my mind, if and when it does happen, it to say, like Bitcoin's OK, you guys can go out and buy it. And this is how you're going to protect yourself because we're going to debase the shit out of the currency. Which by the way, was the ETF. This is the thing that like doesn't get talked about. The ETF, no matter what people say, was not an organic way it got launched. They'll make up the reason on Grayscale GBTC, whatever that ETF we had talked with people BlackRock all the stuff they hated Coinbase nobody like Coinbase, they like the junk bonds. Glenn can talk to you about web three company right off the back of FTX and something shifted behind the scenes and I think this is part of it that you need U.S. citizens to be able to get exposure you onshore a lot of that Bitcoin. So anyway, sorry to jump in, but I think that's just a big component of why the ETFs were. It's not a coincidence 12 months before this happened. Yeah. And there's a, you know, like there's a major historical analogue here, right? So going way back, I can't remember the year when it happened, but the Austria and Hungarian Empire defeated the Ottoman Empire, OK. And they forced the Ottoman Empire to pay them reparations because they blamed them for the war. And they said, we want the reparations in gold, right? And at that time, the world was on a silver standard, right? And the Austrian Hungarian Empire took the gold and said, OK, we're going on a gold standard. And then the Bank of England did the same, right? And then over time, 50 countries went on to a gold standard, right? But guess who stayed on a silver standard? China and India, right? And they got absolutely decimated their economies because the silver has a much lower stock to flow ratio. In other words, it's annual growth rate is higher. And what has a lower annual growth rate as many than Bitcoin? Nothing, right? So if the biggest economy, the world leader goes down this road and then Malaysia and Chile and this country and that country go, OK, we're in, right? The ones who stay out right, they're going to end up like China and India. Yeah, and our friend safe. You know, to your point, history shows it's not possible to insulate yourself from consequences of others holding a money that is harder than yours, which I think has been a theme since we talked about. This is a very Darwinistic game. You either win or you lose, and the only choice is to play it's. It's like the gunpowder safe also. References. That it's like, it's just monetary technology, you better adopt it or you're going to get killed. Yeah. This is the amazing first episode of the revamp came out firing a lot of a lot of like things packed into this that I think we'll be able to pull on in a subsequent episodes. And Glenn, we have to get you back on as well. Yeah, great. RIP. Thanks. Thanks for joining Glenn. And as we mentioned at the top, we'll be back in a couple weeks with a new member of the Early Riders team. So very excited to introduce to him to to the audience and got this new format rolling. So thanks everybody. Awesome. Thanks, Glenn. Take care. Thanks for listening to this week's episode of the show. If you found the information valuable, please share the episode with a friend or leave a rating on your favorite podcast app. All the links we discussed in today's show will be in the show notes inside your podcast app. Before we finish, a quick reminder that Onramp Media is for informational and entertainment purposes only, and nothing should be construed as investment or legal advice. Regardless of where you are on your Bitcoin journey, we'd love to hear from you. Visit onrampbitcoin.com contact to schedule a consultation with one of our private client advisors.
Transcript source: fountain